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I really feel like this is an idea that needs to die. Plenty of abusive and hateful men seem to have no problems with getting the type of relationships they want; this just inadvertently promotes the idea that one needs to be a ‘nice guy’ in order to have a relationship. Not every guy who leans left succeeds in wooing a woman, and right wingers complaining about where the women are at are probably in circles with primarily left-leaning women and they need to go look in a church or country concert or something.
Yeah, i even suspect that what makes men turn a bit more to the right with age is the realization that it’s more likely to find a woman-partner this way.
I.e., adapting “work hard” way of thinking to earn more money, because women are ultimately also largely attracted to wealth.
this just inadvertently promotes the idea that one needs to be a ‘nice guy’
I think if anything we have radically fucked up the messaging if we think “not being a nazi” means “being a niceguy.”
The fascists go for a predatory numbers game, hitting up as many women as possible while hoping they find ones vulnerable enough to get roped into an abusive relationship. It’s a strategy that breaks down against women who socially reinforce self respect amongst each other. Of course, this isn’t unique, as fascism similarly recruits vulnerable men who struggle with self respect. It’s abuse and cruelty all the way down.
There are plenty of women in far right/neo-fascist etc. groups, and often people from those groups have relationships with other people from those groups. Your comment gives very much the impression that only males are fascists, which is absolutely not my experience dealing with Forza Nuova/Casapound people (both neo-fascists parties) in my youth.
I also see the male loneliness epidemic as an orthogonal problem to males being fascists, but that’s yet another topic.
There are plenty of women in far right/neo-fascist etc. groups
There are plenty of the populist Mango Mussolini type fascist women, but AFAIK there are far fewer in the out and proud neo-nazi groups. There’s this interview from this guy who was a neo-nazi until the mid-90s, and he talks about how the complaints from the incels now are the same as back when he was in. There were women in the group, but at a ratio of 7 or 8 to 1.
Yes, I am quite sure that in most countries the distribution of women/men within those groups are not equal and unbalanced towards men.
That said, being a member of the actual group doesn’t mean not being in those people social groups, accepting or even sharing some of their ideas etc.
I think it is at least accurate to some degree - but, sadly, both romantic and sexual attraction are subject to a whole chaotic mess of both conscious and unconscious factors, often out of our own control. Otherwise toxic relationships and paraphilias (using the term in the sense of fetishisations genuinely harmful to yourself and/or others) wouldn’t really be a thing.
So if I’m a lonely guy it can only be because I’m a sack of shit. Cool cool. Love that. Great for the self esteem.
I have all my girlfriends on stream rn, ok so, Canonical_Warlock, so tell us, what have you done to further equity and resist fascism? Last six months is fine if you’re busy. But we really want to hear about the community organizations you’re interested in or working with. We’re listening and ready to fawn and cheer. ٩(◕‿◕｡)۶
Also open to any advice for people who might be basing their esteem on meme stream concerning more nourishing options!
(i am neither sarcastic nor a cop, but the latter can still read replies, so maybe… semirhetorical.)
Most of the people repeating the keywords “male loneliness epidemic” are, but that doesn’t mean you automatically are. You’re probably suffering from the same loneliness people of all genders are.
Even if a lot of the people spamming that phrase are bad it doesn’t mean that it’s not a real thing that affects other non bad people. They’re co-opting real problems to further their agendas.
To take this one step further: shitty memes like this one are used to essentially validate the feelings of the bad actors and the “manosphere.” Especially when the non-bad people try to push back and get the response of “yes, all men,” it just reinforces their stance of “people hate men” and pushes them deeper into the validation loops that the manosphere provides to them.
Right wing men aren’t lonely. They have community. They have validation. They have support. Thats why lonely men go to the right.
So. Counterpoint to this, in that I think those guys should just keep doing what they’re doing.
The bar is so low all I need to do is show up on a date and not say anything racist and I’m in.
In fact: y’all should go even harder with the douchebaggery.
Agreed, I’m currently living in Trumpistan and all it takes is putting a filter on the dating apps to get interest
Step 1 and Step 2 are real, they just aren’t as shallow as the lonely dudes think they are.
There’s actual science on this that says women will get turned on by pretty much anything as long as they feel safe.
So like. The barest amount of cognizance of the objective danger women face, like, constantly, and a respectful effort to show by example that you’re not part of it (which doesn’t mean saying it, like: first off I swear I’m not going to rape you isn’t going to make anyone swoon) and you’re in.
I wish more people understood that the enemy way to make people think you’re a good person is to just be a good fucking person.
I could wish this where fact, but it fails to take into account that beyond punches you also need social grace and appearances surpassing Ralph Wiggum…
Not even remotely true. Reminder that Trump won white women voters in 2024.
Abuse towards women is unfortunately so normalized by society that I bet most of those women don’t realize how much they have been manipulated since childhood to be against their own autonomy, especially if they grew up in a religious environment.
It’s possible that women of minority demographics voted more blue because some realized how anti-(their specific minority) republicans are but, just like the white women, weren’t put off by republicans’ misogyny.
This is very deresponsibilizing though. I don’t think you can explain mass phenomena with it. To me it seems more reasonable to conclude that gender is not that relevant here and that social conditions, education, family upbringing etc. are.
how much they have been manipulated since childhood to be against their own autonomy
And how do you explain poor people voting against their economic interests, immigrants voting for xenophobic parties etc.? I don’t think that individual abuse can be used to explain every case, it feels as a way to rationalize something you can’t justify otherwise (e.g., it’s unimaginable how a woman would vote against her own autonomy). I do believe that everyone in a way is a victim of some kind of influence, marketing, societal pressure, class violence, different biases etc., but we need to draw a line at some point for people to be responsible for their shitty ideas.
To make an example, an immigrant who went through a tough immigration process, with all the anxiety and insecurity it caused, and finally managed to make it is probably going to suffer heavily of survivorship bias and it’s not impossible they will be xenophobic against illegal immigrants and perhaps will even vote for whom proposes harsher immigration policies. You can argue that society abused them etc., but they are still responsible for their ideas.
So my point is that I don’t disagree with you, but we can find exogenous reasons for why people have shitty ideas in all cases. Doing so though we deresponsibilize the individual from checking with themself and reflecting on their own positions. I think it’s fair to consider that some people simply have shitty ideas, are greedy, selfish, racist, classist, or whatever else, without necessarily trying to trace back those ideas to some external factor.
100% some people are genuinely shitty people and their behavior would happen even if society wasn’t misogynist, classist, etc.
My goal wasn’t to alleviate them from responsiblity. I do not believe it is their fault for growing up in a society that is against them, but it is their fault for not thinking crtically and choosing to perpetuate that hate once they are an adult.
Also I was thinking of abuse on a societal level, not an individual level, but that does contribute. (I probably could have used a better word. I do agree that abuse implies individual rather than societal.) I find the fact that so much misogyny and other hate exists within the overton window to be repulsive. Trump said “grab her by the pussy,” (plus a bunch of other terrible things) and got into the oval office not once, but twice, which shows that society has a major problem with finding hate acceptable. Why people find that hate acceptable I imagine varies between demographics.
I still do stand by my previous comment, which is my thoughts on why specifically women voted the way they did, although I agree it has room to be expanded on more.
I think a major part of it is that people simply aren’t thinking things through enough. They should be questioning society’s misogyny, racism, etc, but for some reason they choose to accept it as normal.
Well, that is basically what OP’s meme was saying, though:
That for a man, holding “liberal” values, gets him game.
And that’s just blatantly not true.
In fact, there’s a whole meme around it, being the “nice guy”.
Trad women who have enslavements fetishes
Those are pink women
He did. But by a smaller margin than he won white men.
So, the shortage of men who aren’t nazis is actually there. And I suspect that the nazi women are having little trouble dating.
What if this one nazi-puncher is gay? /s
Gogo nazi-puncher, also kick them too!
I am actually going to be reentering the dating game after a little over 10 years. I sometimes wonder 'am i still attractive ’ but then I remember this…
I’m discovering that it isn’t really “am I attractive?” It’s " I feel attractive."
Like I’m down 100lbs, been pumping my protein and weights, and I got muscle definition where I’ve never noticed muscle definition before.
Clothes that fit, glasses I feel comfortable in. I don’t really want to “date” because I’m so much happier with impressing myself than trying to impress someone else.
I’m lonely, I wonder what’s wrong with me
You must learn to love yourself before wanting to get loved.
It’s hard while being blamed for being lonely
Unfortunately there are a lot of similarly awful women, especially in more rural and suburban areas.
True. Never forget that conservative women exist and they can be highly unpleasant.
And that some of them end up being elected to congress
But you have no meme for that, so how can we believe you?
Don’t date them either!
People forget that women can have like, ultraspecific preferences. Women above a certain age tend to be married, the rest not interested in relationships at all. Then there’s the Lesbians having relationships with each other. This still does not account for the difficulty dating as a man. I guess most do find a partner, but it’s harder, so feels like there’s somehow less women available.
I know a woman who prefers “dad bods”
I don’t get it, really. Maybe I’ve just been really lucky.
I have not been single for more than about 5 months since I was 13 (aside from a short window between 18 and 20 when I worked at an office full of people in their 50s and had no contact with anyone my own age). When my ex and I split after about 13 years, I had several flings between that and meeting my wife. I didn’t go looking for them either. I never once made a pass at any woman until she first said something obvious to me. I don’t do subtlety at all.
I’m not attractive, I’m not tall. I haven’t settled and been with anyone I didn’t find attractive or intelligent (only once, directly after the split with my ex, I was a wreck. She was pretty, but dumb as a box of rocks. I was projecting things onto her that weren’t true at all because of the state that I was in).
I am a musician in a small town though, and almost every girl I ever dated was deeply into music and it usually started from there.
It could just be luck, but I really do believe it has everything to do with confidence and being sure of oneself. I have issues, and a lot of them, but I don’t hold back and I never have. The people who don’t like me have an honest reason not to and the people who do don’t have to guess with me.
I have always been unapologetically who I am wherever I go.
I also prefer the company of no one and spend most of my time in isolation and I’ve still had good luck.
I’m getting older now though, and I’m a stay at home dad these days and more isolated than I’ve ever been. I would say that if my wife were to leave me today, I’d be alone for a very long time.
I’m not bragging here either, I’m not about that kind of thing at all. I’m obviously coming from a position of privilege, be it luck or whatever I have going on here that gives me that privilege. I really do think it would be easier for other men though if they’d find confidence and become very passionate about something that women can relate to. My passion for music has definitely, definitely, definitely helped me.
I even spent many years struggling with drug addiction, would not date anyone who had that problem in common with me, and I still found sober women who were willing to tolerate me.
I don’t know. I just hope that if you feel hopelessly alone and you read this comment, it will give you some hope.
musician dating people with a shared, social, and popular interest
This is the secret btw.
Painting all lonely men as douches is kind of fucked up, no?
Not all lonely men are douches, but most douches are lonely.
Not all douches are lonely. There’s a stereotypical “rich man with a yacht that gets all the women” and the “high school football player who’s an arrogant douche and still gets all the girls”.
I’m not arguing with you either, i’m just writing it for the other people reading this thread.
In my experience, the douchiest of men are surrounded by women. Look at the Tate brothers, for an example.
While I don’t necessarily disagree, citing the Tate brothers for the amount of women around them isn’t great because they’re probably trafficking most of those women.
I’m more referring to their female social media followers, who go on about how great their (toxic) masculinity is, rather than the very real female victims of their narcissism , which you’re quite right to note.
Yeah it’s really invidating and alienating young men.
Liberals wonder why young men flock to the conservative, and then they say stuff that’s just very invalidating. Like, if you want to convince somebody, you have to make an attractive offer. Instead, it feels as if today’s “feminists” are just blaming everything bad in the world on men. Even though your neighbor man has exactly zero responsibility for the world at large.
People just aren’t wired to handle uncomfortable self truths. We haven’t figured out a way to get around it yet as a society.
I wish this was accurate. There would be a lot less fascists.
