Submission Statement

Between 2001 and 2021, under four U.S. presidents, the United States spent approximately $2.3 trillion, with 2,459 American military fatalities and up to 360,000 estimated Afghan civilian deaths.

After the U.S. withdrawal from Afghanistan in August 2021, approximately $7.12 billion worth of military equipment was left behind, according to a 2022 Department of Defense report. This equipment, transferred to the Afghan National Defense and Security Forces (ANDSF) from 2005 to 2021, included:

Weapons: Over 300,000 of 427,300 weapons, including rifles like M4s and M16s.  
Vehicles: More than 40,000 of 96,000 military vehicles, including 12,000 Humvees and 1,000 armored vehicles.  
Aircraft: 78 aircraft, valued at $923.3 million, left at Hamid Karzai International Airport, all demilitarized and rendered inoperable.  
Munitions: 9,524 air-to-ground munitions worth $6.54 million, mostly non-precision.  
Communications and Specialized Equipment: Nearly all communications gear (e.g., radios, encryption devices) and 42,000 pieces of night vision, surveillance, biometric, and positioning equipment.

The total equipment provided to the ANDSF was valued at $18.6 billion, with the $7.12 billion figure representing what remained after the withdrawal. Much of this equipment is now under Taliban control, though its operational capability is limited due to the need for specialized maintenance and technical expertise.

The United States has provided at least $93.41 billion in total aid to Afghanistan since 2001. This includes:

Military Aid (2001–2020): Approximately $72.7 billion (in current dollars), primarily through the Afghanistan Security Forces Fund ($71.7 billion) and other programs like International Military Education and Training, Foreign Military Financing, and Peacekeeping Operations ($1 billion combined).  

Humanitarian and Reconstruction Aid (2001–2025): Around $20.71 billion, including $3 billion in humanitarian and development aid post-2021 and $3.5 billion in frozen Afghan assets transferred to the Afghan Fund in 2022. Pre-2021 reconstruction and humanitarian aid (e.g., $174 million in 2001 and $300 million pledged in 2002) adds to this, though exact figures for the full period are less clear.
  • RabbitBBQ@lemmy.world
    0·
    3 days ago

    Yeah but think how much money grifters made off of it. That $40 trillion in debt had to go somewhere.

  • Hellsfire29@lemmy.world
    0·
    3 days ago

    In our defense, President Ghani abandoned his country and forces and allowed the taliban to take over. The ANA and ANP defected as well, which didn’t help matters any. He felt like he had no chance and didn’t want to add to the violence. Seeing the ana and the anp operate first hand, yes, they would have been obliterated.

    When I was there, the locals appeared to want us there, but also were supplying Intel to the enemy. They knew when the taliban was going to attack, and when we patrolled. I get it, they wanted to stay alive and all.

    I know people think we shouldn’t have been there but look at our exit, and how the locals clung to the planes after take off. They were afraid of retribution from the taliban but for 20 years, they had someone to watch over them.

    However, the taliban takeover was inevitable. We could have won that war, but we said fuck it and left. Why? Because it wasn’t worth it anymore. And the US population thought they knew better. It lost or never had their approvaI. met a lot of cool Afghani locals. Hope they’re alright.

    Just my 2 cents while I was over there for a year. And fuck the taliban. USA shouldn’t send any type of aid there. We left enough there as it is. They don’t call that area the “Graveyard of Empires” for nothing. If they want to live in the stone age, let them. They don’t need anymore outside influence.

    • UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.worldEnglish
      0·
      3 days ago

      Absolutely. The plan was to do in Afghanistan what we’d done in Saudi Arabia and Egypt and Argentina and the Philippines.

      We wanted a local aristocracy beholden to the US business interests with a police force willing to brutalize dissidents. Taliban wasn’t that thing, so they needed to be supplanted.

      Problem was, the Afghan aristocracy that the US aligned with were more vile than the Taliban and rejected by the public at large. So the US spent 23 years killing everyone who refused to submit to them.

        • UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.worldEnglish
          0·
          3 days ago

          Michael Rubin is a resident scholar at the American Enterprise Institute.

          I might take this with a large grain of salt. My man is a neocon’s neocon.

          If you dig into Afghanistan’s history, particularly with regard to the Soviet Union, there were a lot of parallels between the quasi-socialism of the Soviet occupation and the quasi-liberalism of the American occupation.

          In both cases, the occupying army tried to subvert self-determination of the Afghan people. Trying to claim The Taliban as a product of US policy against the Communists or a product of Islamist policy against the Christian Nationalists really misses this as an ongoing effort by Afghanis to secure their own brand of domestic nationalism.

          Get down to “Who is responsible?” Rubin doggedly insists that (a) US support for the Taliban in the '70s was worth the price, entirely to keep Communism out of Pakistan. And (b) we are the victims of imperfect policy rather than our own hubris.

          Both beliefs are ultimately misguided, even if his history is a fun read.

          • smayonak@lemmy.world
            0·
            2 days ago

            It’s strange how Rubin glosses over the CIA’s training and arming of the very extremist groups which conducted 911. I don’t see how anyone can try to argue that arming and training such groups was worth it.

            • UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.worldEnglish
              0·
              2 days ago

              Simple. 3000 dead Americans was a small price to pay to bring down the Evil Empire of the USSR and liberate billions of people from Communism.

              • smayonak@lemmy.world
                0·
                2 days ago

                These people argue that all sacrifices are worth the goal of spreading global freedom even when they turn democracies into dictatorships. These people can never admit they were wrong about anything. Even now when the communist nations are beginning to overtake the west, these fools argue that China is a capitalist nation. They live in a fantasy world.

                • UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.worldEnglish
                  0·
                  2 days ago

                  China is a capitalist nation

                  Capitalism is when people get rich, and the richer you are, the more capitalist you have become.

                  But also, Communism is when everyone hates their government. This proves that Americans are the Communists and China are the Capitalists.

  • Lovable Sidekick@lemmy.worldEnglish
    0·
    3 days ago

    We learned that the Taliban can be right here in your own backyard, and the most important thing is the oil deals you make along the way.

      • Bloomcole@lemmy.world
        0·
        3 days ago

        The Greatest US warrior of all

        The first was for himself. The second for his country. This time it’s to save his friend. 😉

      • AES_Enjoyer@reddthat.comEnglish
        0·
        3 days ago

        I think the text is doctored, in the OG film it’s not so explicit. Feel free to correct me though, I’m working off “I heard it somewhere”.

        • Glytch@lemmy.world
          0·
          3 days ago

          The movie is Rambo 3 and you are correct. The real dedication is to the “Gallant people of Afghanistan”.

      • frezik@midwest.social
        0·
        3 days ago

        Are people who leave the US now in the wake of the Trump Administration also traitors to their country?

        • Bloomcole@lemmy.world
          0·
          3 days ago

          Ridiculous comparison.
          Did a foreign army invade the US and those US citizens collaborated with them, helped them interrogate and torture Americans and plenty more?

            • Bloomcole@lemmy.world
              0·
              3 days ago

              Can you count? You invaders and looters were there until 2021.
              Plenty of collaborators until the last minute.
              Did you forget when your regime goons shot dozens of them in a panic when the last planes left Kabul and a crowd of traitors wanted to join?

                • Bloomcole@lemmy.world
                  0·
                  3 days ago

                  I’m saying I have enough of you propaganda trolls.
                  Your ‘are you saying’ and other transparent fallacy tactics are boring and lame.
                  You’ve been dealth with and you’re doinf a lousy job. Eglin should fire you.
                  Better luck somewhere else.

      • Alloi@lemmy.world
        0·
        3 days ago

        L take. please look up how the taliban treats their own people. they are a regressive ruling class and are extremely cruel to their own people. especially women and children.

        they didnt betray their country, they didnt want to live under an archaic group of power grabbing religious fanatics. there is a difference.

        • Bloomcole@lemmy.world
          0·
          3 days ago

          I don’t need to do shit.

          Looks like you don’t know anything about it except what your propaganda fed you.
          They VOTED overwhelmingly for the Taliban in the first elections held under US invader occupation regime.
          OC that wasn’t to their liking so they annuled it and redid them without the Taliban.
          The american way of democracy.

        • UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.worldEnglish
          0·
          3 days ago

          please look up how the taliban treats their own people

          Okay, but then look at how the Heroin smugglers and child sex traffickers that ran Afghanistan under the US treated their own people.

  • finitebanjo@lemmy.world
    0·
    3 days ago

    TBF, withdrawing was a Trump era decision that Joe Biden simply didn’t stop. Trump also released 5,000+ Taliban Fighters just before. I feel like if we didn’t elect people like Donald fucking Trump then the outcome might have been different, it really seems like he was intentionally causing these problems.

      • UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.worldEnglish
        0·
        3 days ago

        At every stage, the US lost more and more territory. By Biden, they’d been hedged into Kabul like the US was backed into Saigon at the end of the Vietnam War.

        The idea that we could have just camped out and refused to leave was politically impractical and logistically incredibly difficult. And why would we have been there, except to periodically fling bombs into neighboring territory?

        We’d lost the war a decade earlier and simply refused to admit it. By Biden, it was a farce. We didn’t control the country in any meaningful way.

        • Bloomcole@lemmy.world
          0·
          3 days ago

          They never had control, they outsourced a lot of the fighting to the warlords they paid, without them they would have been thrown out a lot earlier

      • finitebanjo@lemmy.world
        0·
        3 days ago

        As long as it took. They had a democracy, they had international trade, they had human rights. You can’t put a pricetag on that. The USA was protecting something worth protecting for a change.

        • Bloomcole@lemmy.world
          0·
          3 days ago

          LOL
          When the first installed puppet got a bit of remorse when he saw the butchery of the US they replaced him with a literal American, Ghani.
          They pulled a reverse Jolani, they made him grow a beard and wear traditional clothes since the locals knew what he was and disliked him.
          https://thegrayzone.com/2021/09/02/afghanistan-ashraf-ghani-corrupt/

          And same as the US he stole all the money and gold he could get his paws on.
          This from a country left in ruins and misery after what the US did.
          Democracy my ass.
          https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/feb/16/afghanistan-money-biden-white-hosue-us

          • finitebanjo@lemmy.world
            0·
            3 days ago

            I’m sorry that you’re on the faction opposing women in education, driving, or any form of authority. I’m sorry that you prefer an actual theocratic dictatorship. I’m at a loss that you didn’t notice the immediate tariffs, sanctions, and funds being frozen when they took over.

            • RadioFreeArabia@lemmy.cafeEnglish
              0·
              3 days ago

              I’m on the faction of “it’s none of your business how Afghans govern themselves and you have no right to enforce your norms on them”. If the puppet regime had any real support it wouldn’t have collapsed in weeks.

              I’m at a loss that you didn’t notice the immediate tariffs, sanctions, and funds being frozen when they took over.

              Who placed the tariffs, sanctions and froze the funds? The US government and its allies being sore losers. You may want to take another look at this:

              Previously, Afghanistan’s trade volume did not exceed $850 million annually, but after the return of the Islamic Emirate, exports surged to $2 billion. In 2024, Afghanistan’s total trade reached $12.42 billion, with exports at $1.803 billion and imports at $10.619 billion. In comparison, in 2023, Afghanistan’s exports were $1.884 billion and imports were $7.71 billion. This shows a 4% decrease in exports and a 38% increase in imports in 2024 compared to the previous year.

              https://www.bakhtarnews.af/en/afghanistans-total-trade-achieves-12-42-billion-milestone-in-2024/

              • finitebanjo@lemmy.world
                0·
                3 days ago

                It became their business many times over the decades starting when it became a strategic territory in the proxy wars between the west and the east. Surrendering to authoritarianism might seem like a cool idea until you’ve given up everything and allowed everyone to suffer. Some fights are unavoidable.

              • Squizzy@lemmy.world
                0·
                3 days ago

                How other people govern themselves is everyone’s business. This isnt a difference of opinion it is brutal totalitarianism. People are killed and you hide behind it being a difference of culture. It isnt acceptable. That said the US are shitbags.

                • RadioFreeArabia@lemmy.cafeEnglish
                  0·
                  3 days ago

                  I disagree with you on the former and it reeks of white-saviour-complex, but I agree with you on the latter. One out of two, isn’t bad.

                  Try to meddle in other countries’ business, try to force your norms on them, and you will be met with resistance. If your values are so much better and universal you wouldn’t need to force them on other nations through military and economic coercion.

                  Edit: I guess you are from the UK. You claim to care about people getting needlessly killed, but if UK troops do it it is okay?: Afghanistan: UK special forces ‘killed 9 people in their beds’

        • Vanilla_PuddinFudge@infosec.pubEnglish
          0·
          3 days ago

          They had a democracy, they had international trade, they had human rights. You can’t put a pricetag on that.

          Around $2.3 trillion.

  • conditional_soup@lemm.ee
    0·
    3 days ago

    This shit haunts me sometimes. I remember hearing somewhere that the Taliban actually offered to deliver OBL to the US if they would promise not to invade and we were like “get fucked, idiot”. How many people’s lives did we needlessly destroy, regardless of nationality, both in Iraq and Afghanistan? What else could have been bought besides misery with the nearly four trillion between those two wars?

    • Rekorse@sh.itjust.works
      0·
      3 days ago

      I didnt know about any of this. The article I read mentioned they offered to put him on trial prior to 9/11 too for his other crimes in the 90s. America is literally the idiot bully who yells over anything you say and then eventually punches you in the face while you are confused.

      • Bloomcole@lemmy.world
        0·
        3 days ago

        He also died of natural causes.
        Been invisible for a decade and wouldn’t you know it, a few months before the presidential elections “we got him”.
        Somehow they showed no footage of him being heroically killed by the brave GI Joe’s.
        They go trough all the trouble of taking his body during a dangerous raid in a hostile country, but somehow they decide all on their own to throw his body from the ship.
        LOL

  • catty@lemmy.world
    0·
    3 days ago

    And we’re supposed to believe these people are smart enough for nukes? I wonder how many of those people can actually read or write?

  • Bigfoot@lemm.ee
    0·
    4 days ago

    Is this text AI generated? The civilian death toll in the “submission statement” is about 6x higher than accepted numbers and about 100K higher than all total deaths in the entire conflict.

    IMO (AI or not) slop like this just “floods the zone with shit” while doing noting to help the progressive cause.

    • brukernavn@lemm.ee
      0·
      3 days ago

      This is in the first paragraph of what you linked:

      The Cost of War project estimated in 2015 that the number who have died through indirect causes related to the war may be as high as 360,000 additional people based on a ratio of indirect to direct deaths in contemporary conflicts.

      • Bigfoot@lemm.ee
        0·
        3 days ago

        I shouldn’t need to tell you that that is a completely different statistic. You don’t need to muddy the waters of truth to make the point.