Summary
Sen. John Fetterman faced backlash from progressives after his first post on Truth Social calling the hush-money case against Trump “bullshit” and suggested pardons for both Trump and Hunter Biden.
Fetterman reiterated his stance from recent interviews, arguing such cases erode public trust in institutions.
The response has been divisive, with Trump supporters and progressives both criticizing him.
Fetterman’s broader shifts, including support for Israel and mocking climate activists, have alienated some Democratic supporters while gaining him favor among conservatives.
There’s a large contingent of anti Zionist Jews in America. Stop conflating Judaism with Zionism.
https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2024/04/02/how-us-jews-are-experiencing-the-israel-hamas-war/
62% of American jews say the way Israel is carrying out its revenge on all Palestnians for Hamas’s actions in October is “acceptable”. 33% say its “unacceptable.” 5% unsure.
Draw your own conclusions from those statistical facts, but dont tell me how I’m allowed or disallowed to view that data, and wrap insinuations and accusations in that suit your narrative. Thats not your business and I have politcal free speech. Facts are facts.
What I dont hear from the broader jewish community is sympathy or support for Muslims, I’ll tell you that straight up. Are Palestinians coequal human beings worthy of rights the same as every other human, goy or not? I’d like to hear you explicitely say it before I take you at all seriously. I’ve been asked for a year if I condemn Hamas oct 7 attacks, so I’d say my question of you is more than fair.
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Well then our opinions overlap. If you check my comments you will find that I am a student of history. I dont know how many comments I have made about the Jewish roman wars, the state of judaism in the middle east during the ottoman era, and comparing the zealots to the zionists but its been quite a few. You wont see me citing that zionists collaborated with nazis like you just did, but I have read that somewhere before as well. I was just never sure I could trust the sources as its so inflamatory. I dont know that we’ll ever truly know the whole story of why Hitler did what he did.
I disagree that the zionists came about 150 years ago. I’d argue that the zionists are the same group as the second temple era zealots, with a rebranded name. If you see any difefrences between the groups, lets see em. Zealots wanted to eject the romans and establish a judean state, which is what they did, using genocide. That state lasted 3 years until the legions marched back and counter genocided. I point this out because Nothing has changed. We’re fighting the same wars for the same reasons. Same genocide, different year.
And I stand my ground on the idea that I have heard very little in the way of support for muslim people in the US media. Anti muslim sentiment is out of control, and anything that even lightly offends judaism is rapidly being criminalized, which is a violation of all of our rights, a bad precendent, and something I find odorous.
You say you’re of the jewish faith, and I tell you I dont care. I’m an atheist. Your cursing and anger doesnt move me much. And if I want to draw conclusions from polls I will. I dont need to wait for a poll that shows me something like “every single person of jewish faith support zionism” before I am allowed by you to say that its logical for fetterman to support zionism in a heavily jewish district, because 2/3 of jews support the war crimes that’ve gone on.
Its simply math, whether you like it or not. I do think your yelling at me about what I can say and what I cant is unamerican and I flatly reject it. Your feefees dont trump my right of free speech, or my right to draw obvious and mathematically sound conclusions from polls. So wrap up all your curse words and shove them right back up your rear.
You’re oversimplifying history by equating Second Temple-era zealots with modern Zionists. The contexts, motivations, and methods are completely different, and ignoring that weakens your argument.
Saying “nothing has changed” since the Jewish-Roman wars ignores how much societies, politics, and conflicts evolve over time. History doesn’t work in simple repeats.
Oh really. Like what, be specific.
Hurray! I get to be specific.
Context
Zealots fought against occupation by Rome, while Zionists emerged in response to antisemitism and the rise of nationalist movements across Europe.
Motivations
Zealots were religiously driven, while Zionism is largely a secular nationalist movement.
Methods
Zealots relied on insurgency and rebellion against an occupying empire. Zionists have used political lobbying, immigration, colonialism, and apartheid rule to ethnically displace Palestinians.
The goal of Zionism is to establish and maintain a Jewish state in the land of Israel. Employed terrorism, murder, political maneuverings, and genocide.
The goal of the Zealots was to establish and maintain a Jewish state in the land of Israel. Employed terrorism, murder, political maneuverings, and genocide.
Are you saying they have the same goals but the “motivations” are different? That doesnt make sense to me. Nor do I agree that one is secular and one religious. The basic law in Israel was modified by the zionists to say specifically, “National rights in Israel belong only to the Jewish people.” Explicitely excluding Muslims. A “nationalist movement” would include non jews. Therefore Zionism is not a secular movement.
Not continuing this nonsense conversation, but let me add some context to your dogwhistles and outright bullshit for the mods and anyone else watching. Also, it’s hilarious how you can’t cite a single thing to back up your claims 😭🤣.
Zealots didn’t commit genocide, and no credible scholar says they did. You’re just making things up. The Zealots used violence and rebellion, but nothing they did comes remotely close to the ethnic violence carried out under Zionism. If you have a credible source (you don’t lol) go ahead and share it. (For the record, they did use terrorism, but that’s not genocide. Learn the difference.)
Zionism was secular from the start. Here’s a direct quote to shut this down:
If you want to argue that Israel isn’t a secular state, fine. But that’s not the point you asked about. You wanted the difference between Zionism and the Zealots, and I delivered.
Zionism, at its core, was a secular nationalist movement aiming to establish a Jewish state in the 19th century, while the Zealots were driven by religious motives in their fight against Roman rule. The fact that Israel’s modern laws don’t reflect that original secular vision doesn’t change the historical distinctions between the two movements.
You asked for specific differences, and I gave them to you on a platter. If you want to keep spouting revisionist nonsense without sources, keep it up—it just makes it clearer to the mods that you’re here for bad-faith arguments, not facts. 🥰
Haha. Liar. Name even one scholar of repute who believes this. Your credentials as “student of history” are severely maligned by this and it might be time for you to hit the books.
I would love to continue a conversation with you but this single malignant statement from yourself has poisoned the well. Ending the discussion here. 🙃
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thats a quote from your comment.
so when I literally read back your own comment material to you, you say I got my facts wrong??
They are not at all dangerous. They never were. You just dont like them and are crybullying. You opened this yelling and cursing at me in a because I pointed out a statistical fact. And now you are in some sort of imagined existential danger. Time to report your comments. You have stepped over the line and violated the TOS multiple times.
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